• Skip to main content
  • Skip to primary sidebar
You are here: Home / Authors / Bart D. Ehrman / Why Not Believe in a Different Kind of God? – Bart D. Ehrman

Why Not Believe in a Different Kind of God? – Bart D. Ehrman

8th July 2017 by Red Johnson Leave a Comment

I have been talking about why suffering is a “problem” in the Jewish and Christian traditions, and here I would like to reflect a bit on a point that some commenters have made, that it is a problem if and only if one has a certain conception of God as a being who is all-powerful, loving, and active in the world.  Someone who has a different understanding of the divine being – or divine beings – almost certainly won’t have this problem.

I will let others on the blog comment on divine beings in other modern religious traditions, outside of traditional Christianity.   But I will say that the pagan world in which Christianity originally began, there were much easier answers to why people suffer if there are powerful deities in the world.  The key is that in the ancient world, everyone except Jews acknowledged that there were *lots* of other deities, at all kinds of level and of all sorts of temperament.  Some divine beings could be hateful, malicious, and antagonistic.   Can’t do much about that.  Even with the good ones – if you got them angry, things could go very wrong indeed.

I would argue that even the religion that became Judaism started out with a multiplicity of deities.  The constant injunctions in the Hebrew Bible not to worship other gods almost certainly arose precisely because so many Israelites *were* worshiping other gods.  Even though the authors of the Bible insisted on the worship of Yahweh, there is little reason to think that that is what was actually happening on the ground.

Moreover, for most of the Hebrew Bible the kind of conception of the divine is henotheistic rather than monotheistic.   In the way I’m defining the terms (various scholars define them variously, but this is the normal way), “henotheism” refers to a religious belief that only one God is to be worshiped, while acknowledging that other gods exist.   This seems to be the view of most of the authors of the Old Testament.

You see it, for example, already in the Decalogue (the Ten Commandments) where the faithful Israelite is sternly instructed “You shall have no other gods before me.”  The commandment is NOT: “You must believe there is only one God.”  On the contrary, the commandment presupposes that there are indeed other gods.  None of them is to be worshiped by those who worship Yahweh (or does it mean not to be worshiped *more* than Yahweh?).

Eventually this henotheism morphed into a true “monotheism” the belief that there is in fact only one God.  The other supposed divine beings are either demons or they don’t exist at all.  (If they are demons they are a still *kind* of divine being, but they are so pathetically weak in comparison with God that they don’t so much count as competitors.)  You find this view, for example, in what is called 2 Isaiah (a book written in the 6th c. BCE, tacked on to the writings of Isaiah of Jerusalem from the 8th c BCE, and now comprising Isaiah chs. 40-55).   God insists that he alone is God, and “there is no other.”

That became the view of Judaism and then, later, Christianity.  There are no gods but God.  Islam, of course, inherited the view much later.  It is within these great monotheistic traditions that the “problem of suffering emerges.”  I know that many (most?) Muslims insist that for them suffering is *not* a problem, but I should say that I know myriad Christians who say it is not for them either.  Conceptually (even though people have their “solutions”) the problem is a problem for anyone who believes there is only one powerful divine being who loves people and yet those people suffer anguishing and truly horrible pain.

And so a number of commenters have suggested that it is simply better to believe in a different kind of God.   Why not simply give up on the idea that God is all powerful?  Why not, in fact, adopt a “deistic” conception of God?  “Deism” in this context usually denotes the belief that there is indeed a divine power in the universe, who may ultimately be “behind it all,” for example, as the one “who got the ball rolling” but who is not actively involved in the world.  So hey, it’s not *his* fault.!

One common way of imagining this is to think that God started the universe in some unknown and probably unknowable way – say, 13.8 billion years ago – and then simply let nature take its course.  Big bang; rapid expansion; formation of galaxies of stars; development of our solar system; formation of earth; cooling of the planet; emergence of first life; evolution.  Then, after those 13.8 billion years are up, just some 200,000 years ago, the appearance of homo sapiens; 190,000 years later, the development of human culture; and so it goes till the invention of the I-phone.  Why not?

Suffering, then, is just the way it works, because it’s how nature works.  “God” – the one who started the whole thing – has nothing to do with it.

So isn’t this a better more intellectually satisfying view?  Why not?

Why not indeed?  I can’t actually think of an argument against this view.  So for me it would be personally plausible.  But – here I’m speaking completely personally – I’ve never seen any reason to believe it.  Why appeal to a divine causality for the start of all things when everything else can be explained apart from divine causality?  The one and only reason I can think of for someone coming up with any such idea is that they started *out* thinking that there was a God; then they came to realize that that belief is problematic for one reason or another (for example, it can’t explain why most homo sapiens over the course of their 200,000 years have lived in excruciating pain and died badly) and so fallen back on a *different* idea of the deity.  But why have any idea of a deity at all?

And what does such a belief give you?   Suppose it’s right.  Then what?  What would it matter?   How would it affect a single thing you think, believe, or do?  How would it have any effect on your life?  I should think that it is in a sense simply a kind of functional atheism.   Yes, there is a god out there, but god has absolutely nothing to do with *me*.

So I don’t know why I should want to believe such a thing.  I don’t know what logic would suggest it. I don’t know how it explains anything that can’t be explained without it (OK, yes, we can’t explain the Big Bang; but if you posit God as the one who made the Big Bang you have the same problem: you can’t explain God.  Ultimately, either way, you can’t explain the First Principle.)  I don’t know how it would change my life.  I don’t know how it is really much of anything except a faint shadow of the Jewish-Christian belief in God with no basis, necessity, or practical effect.  So why believe it?

Again, let me stress, this is just my personal opinion, and it’s not one I insist on.  It’s not based on “scholarship.”  It’s not a view I push on others.  (I’ve never mentioned it before, to my knowledge!)  I don’t mind if others have the opposite view, that some such understanding explains our world better than an atheistic one.  But I’ve never felt or understood either its emotional attractions or its logical necessity.

Filed Under: Bart D. Ehrman, Belief Systems

Reader Interactions

Leave a Reply

Your email address will not be published. Required fields are marked *

Primary Sidebar

Recent Posts

  • peanuts
  • zd
  • (no title)
  • ASSYRIOLOGY ITS USE AND ABUSE IN OLD TESTAMENT 5*
  • Zoroastrianism, Judaism, and Christianity are all connected 5*INFO

Archives

  • February 2023
  • January 2023
  • December 2021
  • October 2021
  • April 2021
  • March 2021
  • February 2021
  • January 2021
  • December 2020
  • November 2020
  • September 2020
  • August 2020
  • July 2020
  • June 2020
  • May 2020
  • April 2020
  • March 2020
  • February 2020
  • January 2020
  • November 2019
  • March 2019
  • January 2019
  • December 2018
  • November 2018
  • October 2018
  • August 2018
  • March 2018
  • December 2017
  • November 2017
  • October 2017
  • September 2017
  • August 2017
  • July 2017
  • June 2017
  • May 2017
  • April 2017
  • March 2017
  • February 2017
  • January 2017
  • December 2016

Categories

  • 10 Commandments
  • A Categories
    • A ICCEBERG – 5*
    • A ICCEBERG – IS THE WORLD A FRIENDLY PLACE?
    • A ICEBERG – 123 P R I V A T E
    • A ICEBERG – 6 DAY WAR
    • A ICEBERG – ABRAHAM
    • A ICEBERG – ADAM AND EVE
    • A ICEBERG – Adam's Penis Bone/Baculum
    • A ICEBERG – Against Our Better Judgment: l by Alison Weir
    • A ICEBERG – ALISON WEIR
    • A ICEBERG – AMAZON KINDLE BOOKS
    • A ICEBERG – ANCIENT EGYPTIAN GODS AND LAWS
    • A ICEBERG – ANCIENT GREEKS AND MYTH
    • A ICEBERG – ANCIENT LAWS AND THE 10 COMMANDMENT SIMILARITY
    • A ICEBERG – AZUSA STREET AND THE WELSH REVIVAL
    • A ICEBERG – BABYLON AND NINEVEH
    • A ICEBERG – BABYLONIANS AND HEBREWS
    • A ICEBERG – BIBLICAL CONTRADICTIONS
    • A ICEBERG – BILL ZEBUB
    • A ICEBERG – BOOKS TO READ
    • A ICEBERG – BRITISH EMPIRE
    • A ICEBERG – BULLSHIT – BELIEVING BULLSHIT ET AL
    • A ICEBERG – CANAAN/ISRAEL
    • A ICEBERG – CHRISTIAN ZIONISM/JEWISH ZIONISM
    • A ICEBERG – CHRISTIANITY REVEALED
    • A ICEBERG – CIRCUMCISION
    • a iceberg – Code of Hammurabi
    • A ICEBERG – CONSPIRACY THEORIES – TITANIC
    • A ICEBERG – CREATION OF ISRAEL AND THE REFORMATION
    • A ICEBERG – CROMWELL AND THE JEWS
    • A ICEBERG – DISPENSATION ISM
    • A ICEBERG – EDENS SERPENTS AND MYTHS
    • A ICEBERG – EDWARD IRVING
    • A ICEBERG – ELBA – ANCIENT CITY, SYRIA
    • A ICEBERG – EVANGELICALS TO BRING ABOUT THE NT APOCALYPSE
    • A ICEBERG – EVOLUTION
    • A ICEBERG – EXODUS
    • A ICEBERG – FALL OF MAN
    • A ICEBERG – FLOOD MYTHS
    • A ICEBERG – FRENCH REVOLUTION/ZIONISM
    • A ICEBERG – FROM THE EXODUS MYTH FACEBOOK
    • A ICEBERG – GENESIS
    • A ICEBERG – Genesis 1-11 and Its Mesopotamian Problem
    • A ICEBERG – GENESIS-LILITH
    • A ICEBERG – Genetic Roots of the Ashkenazi Jews
    • A ICEBERG – H.L. Mencken
    • A ICEBERG – HAMMURABI HIS LAWS AND HIS GODS
    • a iceberg – Heaven and Hell are not ancient Jewish and Christian ideas
    • A ICEBERG – Hebrew and Babylonian Traditions/Similarities
    • A ICEBERG – HECTOR AVALON
    • A ICEBERG – HOLOCAUST OF HUMANS NOT JUST JEWS
    • A ICEBERG – HOW AND WHY GOD EVOLVED
    • A ICEBERG – HOW THE BIBLE COPIED FROM OLDER STORIES
    • A ICEBERG – HOW USA CAME INTO WW1
    • a iceberg – human genocide
    • A ICEBERG – INVENTION OF THE HEBREW BIBLE
    • A ICEBERG – IS THE TORAH DIVINE
    • A ICEBERG – IS THE WORLD A FRIENDLY PLACE?
    • A ICEBERG – ISRAELI TERRORISM – CREATION OF ISRAEL AND 6 DAY WAR
    • A ICEBERG – JERICHO
    • A ICEBERG – JOHN NELSON DARBY
    • A ICEBERG – LAW
    • A ICEBERG – LIST OF BLOGS AND INFO
    • A ICEBERG – LLOYD GEORGE WW2
    • A ICEBERG – MAN MADE GODS
    • A ICEBERG – MEME
    • A ICEBERG – Michael David Magee
    • A ICEBERG – MISCELLANEOUS
    • A ICEBERG – MONTANISM
    • A ICEBERG – MOSES
    • A ICEBERG – MOSES VS SARGON
    • A ICEBERG – MOUNT SINAI AND THE LUNAR GOD SIN
    • A ICEBERG – MOUNT SINAI AND THE LUNAR GOD SIN
    • A ICEBERG – Nanna/Suen/Sin (god)
    • A ICEBERG – Napoleon and the Jews
    • A ICEBERG – NOAH AND THE FLOOD
    • A ICEBERG – ORIGINAL SIN
    • A ICEBERG – PALESTINE
    • A ICEBERG – PDF
    • A ICEBERG – Persistence of Myth
    • A ICEBERG – PIOUS FRAUD
    • A ICEBERG – Protocols of the Elders of Zion FACT OR FICTION
    • A ICEBERG – RABBINICAL JUDAISM
    • A ICEBERG – RED HEIFER
    • A ICEBERG – RED JOHNSON
    • A ICEBERG – REVIEW
    • A ICEBERG – SABBATH
    • A ICEBERG – SCOFIELD PRE MILL bs
    • A ICEBERG – SCRIBED
    • A ICEBERG – SIN
    • A ICEBERG – SIN DOES NOT EXIST
    • A ICEBERG – Stephen Sizer
    • A ICEBERG – Sumerian Influences on Western Religion
    • A ICEBERG – SUMERIAN LIFE AND BELIEFS
    • A ICEBERG – THE BIBLE IS NOT HISTORY
    • A ICEBERG – THE CHURCH OF TRUTH
    • A ICEBERG – THE CREATION OF GOD
    • A ICEBERG – THE GOD ENKI SUMERIAN
    • A ICEBERG – THE JEWISH PARASITE
    • A ICEBERG – THE MORAL ANIMAL BY ROBERT WRIGHT
    • A ICEBERG – THE PENTECOSTAL-CHARISMATIC MOVEMENT
    • A ICEBERG – UGANDA CHOSEN FOR THE JEWSS
    • A ICEBERG – Ugaritic story of Athtar
    • A ICEBERG – Walter Reinhold Warttig Mattfeld
    • A ICEBERG – Whitney Webb 5*+
    • A ICEBERG – WHY FARMING?
    • A ICEBERG – Why Humans Have No Penis Bone
    • A ICEBERG – WHY THE BIBLE CANNOT BE THE WORD OF GOD
    • A ICEBERG – WOODROW WILSON BRANDIS COL HOUSE SAMUEL UTTERMAYER
    • A ICEBERG – YAHWEH
    • A ICEBERG – ZIONISM AND CREATION OF ISRAEL
    • A ICEBERG -VICTORIAN HORROR STORIES
    • A ICEBERG 5*+
    • A iceberg Sapiens: A Brief History of Humankind – Yuval Noah Harari
    • A ICEBERG SUMERIAN DICTIONARY GODS AND DEMONS…..
    • A ICEBERG-SINAI
    • A ICEBERG-Walter Reinhold Warttig Mattfeld
    • A ICEBURG – RECEPTION HISTORY
    • A ICELAND – FROM THE EXODUS MYTH FACEBOOK
    • A ICELAND – VIDEOS
    • A ICELBERG – AGAINST THE GRAIN JAMES SCOTT
    • Abraham
    • Abrahamic Religions
    • Afterlife?
    • AI ICEBERG – BOOKS TO READ
    • Alexander Heidel
    • Allah
    • Animal Sacrifice
    • Animals
    • Anthropomorphic
    • Anunnaki
    • Apocalypticism
    • Ark of the Covenant
    • ASSYRIOLOGY ITS USE AND ABUSE IN OLD TESTAMENT
    • Astrology 
    • Atheistism
    • Author Unknown
    • HUMAN GENOCIDE
  • Ancient Civilizations
    • Animal Sacrifices
    • Human Sarcrifice
  • Authors
    • Baron Paul Henri D'Holbach
    • Bart D. Ehrman
    • Colin Wilson
    • Eustace Mullins
    • Frank Moore Cross
    • G. W. Foote
    • Jason Long
    • John Byrne MD
    • Joseph Campbell
    • Joseph Wheless
    • Joshua J. Mark
    • Karl Marx and Communism
    • M. D. Aletheia
    • Marlene Winell
    • Matt (Blogger)
    • Mike Magee
    • Peter Dudink
    • Prof. Ze'ev Herzog
    • Richard Carrier
    • Richard Dawkins
    • Robert Cooper
    • Robert Green Ingersoll
      • Freethought
    • Saladin
    • Sam Harris
    • Samuel Noah Kramer
    • Scott Atran
    • Valerie Tarico.
    • Vexen Crabtree  
    • Walter Reinhold Warttig Mattfeld y de la Torre
  • B to L Cat
    •  Conspiracy Theory
    • Ashkenazi
    • Babylon
    • Babylonian Legends of the Creation
    • Balfour Declaration
    • Belief in Belief
    • Belief Systems
    • Bible Archaeology
    • Bible Contradictions
    • Bible Inconsistencies
    • Biblical Myths
    • Biblical Nonsense
    • Birth of Civilisation
    • Black Race
    • Blood Sacrifice
    • Bolshevik Revolution
    • Bolshevism
    • Book Form
    • Books to Read
    • Bullshit
    • Canaanite Religion
    • Christianity
    • Christianity-Biggest Lie Ever Told
    • Circumcision
    • Code of Jewish Law is Called "HALACHA" (The Way)
    • Cognitive Dissonance
    • Collapse of Ancient Civilisation
    • Concept of Sin
    • Conspiracy
    • Constellation Legends
    • Contradictions in the Bible
    • Counsel of the Gods
    • Creation
    • Creation Myths
    • Creation of Israel
    • Cure from Religion – Judaism/Christianity/et al
    • David and Solomon – Kings of Israel
    • Did humans invent Gods?
    • Divine Number 12
    • Documentary Hypothesis
    • Does God Exist?
    • Doublethink
    • Egyptian Ancient
    • Elul
    • Empires
    • Epic of Gilgamesh
    • Evil God
    • evilbible.com
    • Evolution
    • Exodus
    • Exodus Did Not Happen
    • Fables
    • Free Will
    • Freemasonry
    • Genesis
    • God
    • God is Imaginary
    • God is Nonexistent
    • Gods of Ancient Egypt
    • Ham (Noah)
    • Hebrew Myths
    • Hermeticism
    • Hide and Seek God
    • Historical Deception
    • Historical Revisionism
    • History
    • History's Greatest Lies
    • Hitler
    • Hittite
    • Holocaust
    • Human Sacrifice
    • ICEBERG – Walter Reinhold Warttig Mattfeld
    • Iceberg – Zionism
    • ICEBERG – ZIONSIM
    • Illusion/Reality
    • In Gods We Trust
    • infidels.org
    • Israeli-Palestinian Conflict
    • Janus Parallelism
    • Jehovah
    • Jesus
    • Jewish Bullshit
    • Jewish law
    • Jews
    • Joshua
    • Judaism/Christianity/Islam
    • Judeo-Christian
    • Judeo/Christian god does not exist
    • Judiasm
    • Khazars
    • King David
    • King Saul
    • King Solomon
    • KJV
    • Kuzari Argument
    • Law
    • Laws of the Moral and Physical World
    • Leaving Religion
    • Link to Webpage
    • List of Books for Atheists/Agnostics/Free-Thinkers
    • Mass Revelation (Sinai, Fatima et al)
    • Pious Fraud and Lies
    • Racism
    • Sephardi
    • Solomon's Temple and its Cost
  • DESERT FABLE
  • M to Z
    • Bible Myths
    • Bible Parallels in Other Religions
    • Biblical Contradictions
    • Biblical Discrepancies
    • Books and Articles pdf
    • Breaking the Spell of Religion
    • Code of Law by Hammurabi
    • Colonel House
    • Creation Myths
    • Cyrus Scofield
    • El
    • Eustace Mullins
    • Evil
    • Exodus
    • Genesis
    • Gods/Goddesses
    • Hammurabi's Code and the Law of Moses
    • Israel
    • Israel
    • Man invented gods
    • Man invented religion
    • Memes
    • Mesopotamia
    • Mind Virus
    • Miscellaneous
    • Molech
    • Monotheism
    • Morality
    • Moses
    • Moses/Hitler
    • Myth of Sin
    • Myth of the Ten Lost Tribes
    • Myths
    • Nephilim
    • No Gods
    • No pork we're Jewish
    • Noah Flood
    • Noahide Laws
    • NWO
    • Old Testament
    • Old Testament/Torah/Tanach
    • Original Sin
    • Palestine
    • Parasites
    • Passover
    • Pdf
    • PDF articles
    • PDF Books
    • Persia
    • Personality Flaws Hide Behind Religion
    • Philosophy
    • Pictures (pic)
    • Plagiarise
    • Plato
    • Poetry and Verse
    • Psychology
    • Psychosis and Fanaticism
    • Pyramids
    • Quotations
    • Racism
    • Red Johnson
    • Red's anti-religious Rants
    • Red's Muse
    • Religion
    • Religion and Climate
    • Religion Exposed
    • Religion is a Man-made concept
    • Religion is used as an emotional hook to control
    • Religion Without God
    • Religious Lies
    • Religious Lies
    • Religious Trauma
    • Sabbath Origins
    • Samuel Untermyer
    • Satan/Devil/Old Nick Myth
    • Science and Morality
    • Science and Religion
    • Sea Peoples
    • Sicarii, or Dagger-men
    • Sin
    • Sinai
    • Sir Francis Bacon
    • Skepticism
    • Sky God(s)
    • Starred *
    • Storytelling and Fairy Tales
    • Sumerians
    • Summaries
    • Sun and Moon worship
    • Supernatural nonsense
    • Talmud
    • Terrorism
    • TGP
    • The "church" of Truth
    • The Bible Was Influenced By Other Religions
    • The Biggest Lie Ever Told
    • The Body of God
    • The Church of Truth
    • The First World War 1914-1918
    • The Foundations of Western Civilization
    • The Gilgamesh Epic
    • The God Hypothesis
    • The Impossible Voyage of Noah's Ark
    • The Jewish State/Israel
    • The Nonsense of Noah
    • The Philosophy of Horror
    • The Problem of Evil
    • The problem with Miracles
    • The Religion Virus
    • The Second World War – (1939-1945)
    • Theological Terrorism
    • There is no god
    • Timeline
    • Torah
      • The OT fabrication that the Israelite's were slaves in Egypt.
    • Torah – Biggest Lie Ever Told
    • Torah is Ahistorical
    • Ugarit
    • Videos
    • Violence/Bible
    • War
    • Western Civilisations
    • Western Philosophy
    • White Race
    • Why do Jews circumcise on the 8th day?
    • William Shakespeare
    • Winston Churchill
    • Wizard of Oz
    • Woodrow Wilson
    • Yahweh
    • Yahweh
    • YouTube
    • Zeitgeist
    • Zionism
    • Zootheism
    • Zoroaster
    • Zoroastrianism

© 2023 &middot From The Exodus To The Ridiculous